Kevin Robbins: Minister Focusing on Radical Optimism

I have a deep respect and admiration for a minister (evangelist, pastor, cleric, chaplain, missionary, priest, rector, preacher, Reverand). The job of a minister is tough and demanding. It can be satisfying from an intrinsic perspective. However, there are metrics to deal with. The modern-day minister has to be a CEO, CFO, COO, orator, shepherd, counselor all in one. The spotlight is always on the minister and their families. The profession is fraught with risks, temptations, challenges, difficulties, and burnout. How do you measure the transformation of the heart, the alteration of lives, and ministry effectiveness? The exercise of faith, hope, love, forgiveness, and having a healthy congregation is hard to compute. However, it is these very concepts that the minister is trying to move forward in the congregation.

I have had the privilege to interview David Adams, Senior Pastor at Stone Ridge fellowship on moving from success to significance, Joanna Lafleur from the TV show See Hear Love on communication, Jonathan Manafo from The Village Whitby on Christmas, Pastor Beth on prayer, Mark Strickland minister from the People Church on dating, Lorie Hartshorn from 700 Club Canada on faith, Chris Vacher minister on creative leadership and Gillianne Brisboise from the Church of Christ on love in action.

I am excited to interview Kevin Robbins, a senior minister from Milestone Ministries. I met Kevin more than 25 years ago when his father-in-law used to mentor me. I have always found Kevin to be a down-to-earth, humble, a great listener, and a man who loves his wife, daughters, and mother-in-law. Kevin does not let the past define him. He is focused on the future, making it a better place, creating value for other humans, and making a difference.  I had not seen him for more than a decade and then ran into him at a party. We talked in detail about getting help in different areas of life. Kevin is introspective and is always looking at how he can get better. I admire how he has pivoted his organization through the challenges of COVID-19.

Kevin is real and vulnerable in this interview. As a minister, a father, and a husband he has come out on the other side thriving. I am super encouraged by this interview and I hope you read it a couple of times and apply the golden nuggets to your life.

Kevin, an honor to have you on Four Columns. I want my audience to know a little about you?

Everyone has a launchpad in life that shapes who they are. Mine was growing up in rural northern Canada. We were a family of six that subsisted well below the poverty line. Living in a small log cabin with no water and electricity and my family was burdened by many internal and external stressors that included chronic unemployment, social marginalization, domestic disputes, alcoholism, and significant mental health issues.

This foundational stage of my life created a desire to find meaning and value for the remainder of my days and I’m blessed to be on a journey with the love of my life Lisa. We have two married daughters that have launched vibrant careers. I have become a church-planter and church-builder over the last 30 years, have lived in Los Angeles, Vancouver, Halifax, and Toronto received a Masters’s degree, become an author and motivational speaker that focuses on the best life everyone should be living.

You have been a minister for three decades. It is a tough, grueling job. What drew you to become a minister and what is your why?

Most people in church ministry will tell you that they felt “a calling” to the job and I suppose I am no different. But since that phrase is somewhat cliche, my specific answer would be to give. Early in my life, I decided the life that makes the most sense for me was to create value for others.

You have been married for three decades. I want to know the practical secrets of having a strong and vibrant marriage like yours?

Lisa and I love being married, in fact, other than our faith and the kids that came as a result of our marriage, love and our marriage is our most favorite thing in life!

In my opinion, having a strong and vibrant marriage is not hard at all. The secret is the priority. None of us need to be lectured about priorities, we all have a couple of things in life that are the most important to us proven by the amount of time, thought and effort we put into them. The hardest part of marriage is deciding if it will rank as your highest priority…if you are willing to prioritize, your commitment to each other gets a lot easier.

Before the pandemic of 2020, Lisa and I traveled and gave keynote lessons at marriage conferences around North America. When the world shut down, on the suggestion of some close friends we launched weekly episodes on YouTube called Marriage Monday. We were amazed at the hundreds and sometimes thousands of couples that joined the live stream and still do each week.

During the height of the lockdown, we wrote a book called Stay Home Marriage, How to Stay In Love Before, During and After a Global Pandemic. We kept the book short and fun, and it was a rewarding experience. We especially have enjoyed seeing how it has connected and resonated with couples around the world. The premise of the book is based on the simple idea that life, health, career, and legacy are enhanced when you make your marriage a priority. You can find out more about it and link to our videos at wildmarriage.com.

What are some of the secrets of living with three women? I live with two and sometimes or many times I have to keep my sarcastic humor to myself?

I’ve heard the urban legend that boys are easier to raise than girls because girls are too complex when they become teens. I don’t believe it, I’ve always thought “God knew what he was doing when he gave me daughters, not sons.”  For me, boys are just too loud, smelly, and end up breaking most of your most expensive stuff!

Seriously, there’s no doubt that eventually, the male and female worldviews come into conflict with one another when you live under one roof. If a man’s brain is a waffle and a woman’s brain is spaghetti (or whatever metaphor is most trendy right now) there are going to be a lot of opportunities for bumps within our interactions. Patience and communication are the lynchpins to keep everyone connected.

Lisa serves as an interpreter in our family, and she educates me as to why my very logical statements (IMO) don’t make sense to the girls, why my sarcasm isn’t actually funny but caustic to the women in the house, or why whenever I’m asked what I am feeling and I say, “I dunno, nothin’”, that is inconceivable to the women of my family!  I know my wife works equally hard explaining the intricacies of the male brain to my daughters because I often see them huddle to decipher and debrief after one of my family-famous pontifications about the way the world should be.

Fatherhood changed me forever. What did you learn from fatherhood?

I appreciate my father. I think about him often. He had a very difficult life. He suffered from severe mental health issues and when I was 13 years old, he died of suicide.

One of the biggest lessons I’ve learned from fatherhood is that negative cycles can be broken. In fact, for the sake of my children, negative cycles must be broken. I have no patience for self-pity that manifests itself in fatherhood that pulls back from the spouse and kids only to get lost in the perpetual adolescence of work, sports, or hobbies that ultimately exclude family. To me, there are only two things more important than my children, my faith and their mother. Everything else, albeit fun, is way down the list of important.

Talk to me about how we can become better fathers, husbands, brothers, and just ethical men in our culture?

It’s my observation that every father, husband, and brother will eventually reach a crossroad moment to take a stand on principle or collapse into a character deficit. This becomes not only a defining moment personally, but it shapes your legacy impact on all who are connected to you. I think being a principled person is how to become “better”.

Most claim to have bed-rock principles, but few live it out. It is ironic that adults usually think the height of peer pressure happened in their teen years, but we all know it’s alive and thriving now…among C-suite corporates, marketing, sales, laborer’s and even in those of the church-attending crowd.  Worry about status, standing, and what others think and say about us will eventually gut our ethics and we soon find we’re moving the goalposts of what is and is not integrity.

Admittedly, taking a stand on principle can lead to a lonely place. It may result in devastating disappointment when even those you have considered allies and friends turn from you or worse, on you. I’ve seen many men decide it’s too much of a price to pay, but if you’re asking how you as a solitary participant in this life can exact ethical change, this is how you do it; demand integrity over the illusion of popularity.

I have a sticky note at my desk that I read often, “One of the truest test of integrity is its blunt refusal to be compromised.” – Chinua Achebe

Faith is very important to you. Talk to me about the practical aspects of your faith. How can we use unconditional love, forgiveness, compassion, gentleness, peace, patience, and gentleness in this world that is hurting?

Yes, faith is very important to me. I consider it first among my top three priorities of life. I’ve devoted my life in pursuit of understanding who God is and equally complex, who I am supposed to be (still working on that concept!). It has not always made for an easy journey, but faith continues to be my most treasured possession.

You mentioned love, forgiveness, compassion, gentleness, peace, patience, and gentleness, I call these the Big 7. As humans, we are undeniably drawn to this list and we search for a safe place where we will be treated with such generosity. But offering the Big 7 consistently to others around us is usually quite difficult.

The word gospel in Greek is euangelion and it means simply “good news”. I believe this good news is summed up in the Big 7. At any given time there seems to be so much in this world that is out of control or getting worse, we can barely understand it all and we certainly can’t control it all, but at the very least, we can choose to drop in any of the Big 7 and good news makes an impact to any hurting place in this world.

I hear of some of my contemporary ministers deriding society, crying for the morality of days gone by and adding to theories that lend themselves to conspiracy. I don’t see it the same way. It is a historical fact that the euangelion always endures in every changing season. If things get dark, the good news will be light. When life becomes sorrowful, the good news will offer joy. When regret rules the day, the good news gives a new start.

The good news of unconditional love, forgiveness, compassion, gentleness, peace, patience, and gentleness always win the day. It may take a while…but always wins. The only question is, will I give the Big 7 away to others?

Walk me through a typical day as a minister and what are the modern challenges that a minister faces today?

The typical day of a minister is atypical. My congregation has over a thousand active members, so it is not unusual for my day to begin with concise plans and appointments that suffer a slow death by way of interruption. I don’t say that with any resentment, it is just that anyone who wants to operate successfully in the business of people needs patience and a desire to bring value to others often over structured goals.

That said, a typical day usually begins early with reading, study, and prayer followed by connecting with those in the community who are in need. The business hours of the day often hold preparation for sermon series, lessons, and teaching classes, training interns, and mentoring younger ministers and staff. There is an administration team to attend to, worship teams, digital teams, and social media teams. The later part of the day usually allows the opportunity to meet with those requesting life direction and counseling. Of course, there is always the rhythm of church meetings like Sunday services, midweek meetings, weekly small group gatherings, board of directors meetings, elders and deacon meetings and the list goes on. Most days are physically and emotionally taxing, but I enjoy them. I have a dear uncle who every time he sees me is compelled to tell the same tongue-in-cheek joke, “Ministers have the best job in the world because they only work one hour a week on Sunday morning.” I politely laugh each time he says it, but I can assure you, it’s far from an accurate characterization.

In 2020 churches, like every other organization, have leaped into the digital world. Because of COVID-19, there was no “learning curve”, it was more like a “learning rock wall” …straight up and a lot of bruises when you fall! Most ministers I know are exhausted after more than a year trying to find, listen, help, encourage, laugh and cry with their members. Measurements for success in a church are arbitrary metrics, at least difficult to define on an excel spreadsheet.

No one knows for sure what “church” will look like on the other side of the pandemic, but I’m certain it will be different. Between you and me, I think that’s kind of exciting and I look forward to it!

Let’s talk food. What are some of your favorite haunts in Toronto?

I live in one of the most cosmopolitan cities in the world and it offers a gastronomic celebration everyday…if you’re adventurous enough! Honestly, because I live in Toronto it feels like my favorite restaurant haunt changes weekly, but right now it is Drupatis, offering West Indian fare and my personal favorites are called Doubles, small pastry pockets filled with a chickpea filling. Way better than it sounds. You gotta try it!

2020 was a brutal year for me. There are many who are reading this who are hurting. As a minister talk to me about hope, persevering, overcoming evil with good, and staying focused?

There is no denying that 2020 and the beginning of 2021 have been difficult for everyone. The truth is, we don’t even know the entire story yet. I’m sure over the next decade researchers will give us statistics that reveal the massive challenges we all endured in the economy, education, politics, mental health, marriage, parenting, and our physical, emotional, and spiritual well-being. Not to mention that we are literally living out an experiment in real-time regarding the impact of social media and screen-time usage. We are present-day over-comers if we know it or not.

This last year forced Lisa and me to deeply examine how we evaluate the world around us. It was getting too easy to become discouraged, despondent, cynical, and hopeless. So, we asked ourselves why and then we wrote the first chapter of our book and gave it the title “Porch Pirates and Other Thieves”. In short, it is an exploration of the importance of radical optimism and refusing to let life’s outward circumstances steal from the life you can be living.

Among the most encouraging ideas is that you play a role in changing the way you think, in fact, you must. It’s not just embracing a disconnected pollyanna view of your life or white-knuckling your way through the difficult times, but it is literally rewiring your brain through neuroplasticity.  Every single thought, whether positive or negative makes a lasting connection, so why not make the thoughts good?

As a minister I love the way our society’s ground-breaking brain research is matching some ancient Biblical advice, “whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things.” – Philippians 4:8

Whatever you do, never forget there’s a lot of good around you. Think about it.